The kids may not be all right. If nothing changes, or is allowed to change, housing will be unaffordable to most middle income earners. It already mostly is, and is not getting better.
Someone must be paying for these expensive houses, otherwise the prices would come down. The extremely wealthy for whom price is no object are probably not the culprits, because they want mansions with views, near the golf courses and marinas. That ought to leave plenty of middle class housing in normal average neighborhoods for the rest of us, yet somehow that’s not the case. There is definitely a disconnect somewhere and the cynical side of me says it’s not by accident, but I don’t know enough about it to even attempt to know who to blame.
There are many, many factors, some interrelated and some standalone. Placing blame is not productive, and often derails consensus building. Things we could do locally to encourage more building is to allow for more density, and a diversity of housing types. We have not, generally, built starter homes in the northeast for several decades, as they are not profitable for builders, especially in areas with large minimum lot sizes. There are many studies that discuss this. Here’s a link to one that focuses on the lower Hudson Valley: https://www.pattern-for-progress.org/portfolio/outofreach2024/
We’re certainly facing some challenges in our economy these days, ones we didn’t face fifty years ago.
Markets and manufacturing are now global. New technology has upended how we do business. Agriculture is more and more a corporate enterprise rather than a local one, with family farms disappearing. Many businesses have relocated in an effort to reduce costs (that is, pay their workers less) and maintain or increase profits. In the retail sector, local retail is struggling to compete against the Walmarts and Dollar Store giants. Manufacturing has lost out to the service sector as an engine of our economy. Membership in labor unions is at an all time low.
We seem to have, in some ways, reverted to the Robber Baron era of the late 1800’s, where large private enterprises and their owners amassed great wealth through exploitative practices.
It’s time for our government to better address the needs of lower- and middle-income people, and of the vulnerable, instead of catering to the desires of the powerful and wealthy.
The powerful and wealthy own the politicians. The lower and middle income people are just trying to survive in this economy. Our National Grid bill this month $650.
I just read this NYT article in reference to the topic you raised, Ken.
VP Harris is talking about tackling two sides of the housing problem. She is proposing helping first time home buyers with a 25K down payment, and regulating rental gouging by companies that are buying large number of dwellings in an area and proceeding to raise rates. As an economist, I see housing supply as the biggest problem for young home buyers. Around our area, we see apartment clusters being built as rental units. Our children are paying rent that used to be almost enough to make a mortgage payment. It is a tough situation that needs intervention. Perhaps some added tax incentives for the private sector to build houses in target areas around the country would help. Urban planning will also have to include better public transportation, schools, and more.
My children feel the exact same way. They have done everything right but don’t see a path to home ownership AND children because of the cost. They can’t compete with cash offers on homes over $250,000 and starter homes are tiny with those big prices.
Went to the Glens Falls Planning Board meeting yesterday re the Glen Street planned demolition of that gorgeous house at 391. About 80 people were there, clearly to protest the ugly building that might replace it. BUT, the clever and devious owner requested his case be tabled until next month.
Please persist in your information spreading, so that lots of protesters will come in October.
I am certainly not against affordable housing, zoning changes to increase density, reduce required lot sizes, etc., but demolishing one's beautiful heritage shouldn't be the means to that end.
I hope you and Will and everyone who has been made aware of this issue keep it in the public eye for next month's meeting and beyond.
I remember a visit to Glens Falls when my uncle was still President(I think) of the college and he and my aunt lived on or next to a pond that ducks spent the winter on. Still have a picture somewhere of him sitting in a lawn chair (in the snow) with one duck on his head and others all around him. I remember seeing - I think - a wood duck family with a next in one of the trees on the pond. This was many years ago.
I hope there will be another large group next time. I was heartened to see as many people as I did there. This kind of thoughtless project shouldn’t be allowed to happen on Glen Street let alone other streets in our city. I also find it unconscionable that there was no overs it on the finished project behind the old middle school. His plans called for raised planters and grass not Astro turf and a cement wall. Where is the follow through but the city. Shame on him and shame on us for letting this be overlooked.
I’m hoping Will Doolittle keeps this in the forefront so people won’t forget to attend.
I'm a senior, but it strikes me that many of our young generation are spoiled due to the relative affluence they we raised in. For example, many more young couples are childless and yet they own pets which cost them thousands a year and drain their resources. They also often fall into money traps such as carrying CD debt. Mommy and Daddy might be unable to help them,but if they start living within their means and budget wisely, they should be able to buy a home and have kids.
I'm a senior too - and yeah there are spoiled young people - few older ones too! But another part of the blame goes to our education process. There is a lack of history and civics being taught presently, and frankly, it wouldnt be a bad thing to teach kids common sense in regard to the difference between wanting something and needing it. Possibly learning how to make up a budget & stick to it. Having the newest version of whatever really isnt necessary - but that pertains to not only young people but the parents. It feels like thats where much of the credit card debt comes from.
On the other hand - maybe this is the usual looking at the difference between one generation and another?
Maybe the younger generations aren’t so much spoiled by affluence, as by unrealistic expectations. TV, and now social media, has amped them up even more. We compare ourselves to what we think everyone else has. Look at the apartment in the old Honeymooners show. Jackie Gleason’s character was a bus driver, I think, a nice middle class job, and their apartment was small, simple and not much to look at. Archie Bunker was a blue collar worker, and the house in All in the Family was also modest and plain, but I don’t think either of those sets were supposed to imply desperate poverty. They were probably supposed to seem like appropriate accommodations for the characters, and no one watching was supposed to feel sorry for them for where they lived. I think over the years the depictions of middle class homes in television and film have been upgraded, for lack of a better word, so that it seems normal for characters with middle class jobs to live in large, beautifully decorated homes, with landscaped yards, and brand new cars, or in fashionable lofts in trendy cities. (There’s probably a lot of subliminal product placement behind that!) Everyone is out looking for fabulousness right off the bat, and so that is what builders are offering. And those large fancy homes and luxury apartments cost more to build and to buy.
In regards to the Planning Board Meeting last evening. It was good to see so many people show up for the meeting regarding Chris Patten's ongoing projects. It is an absolute shame that the resident of 391 Glen has been given an eviction notice. Shame on those Attorneys who still own the BLDGs, (Patten does have a contract on the property). Hopefully the additonal month will give us more time to gather MORE people for the next meeting.
Several people complained to the board that we could not hear them. They spoke up for a brief moment but went back to speaking softy which made it difficult to hear their remarks. I found very little concern from the board for all the people in the room to see diagrams of proposed signage, etc. and to speak up so ALL people could hear them and the speakers. Lets try to do a better job so we are all informed of what is being presented, etc.
On top of everything else, young people have to tackle climate change, and the really young ones have to face gun violence in their schools. It’s harder for young people now.
I think life is all about priorities. My husband and I grew up in NY towns we could not afford to buy houses in, so we moved to lower cost areas. We both had good solid jobs as systems engineers in IBM in our 30’s. Interest rates in the mid 1980’s were 18%. Our parents had little savings and could not help us with a down payment, so we bit the bullet, used all our measly savings, paid PMI by paying less than 20% down, and jumped in. To make matters worse, we could no longer depend on mass transit, moving from NYC, and had to buy two train tickets for commuting, and a car to get to the train station, buy groceries, and visit our families. Our furniture was hand me downs, or we did without.
Fast forward: We are now in our middle and late 70’s, retired, put our daughters through college without loans, and I’m proud to say our children are in their 30’s, have three children each and own their own homes. I believe dreams can come true if one sets goals and prioritizes needs and wants. Unless one comes from wealth, it’s not until the mid 30’s where dreams become realities.
Coming out of school, landing a great paying job and having a house in a great neighborhood and a fancy car take time, effort, and prioritizing. My grandmother and grandfather ran from Europe after countless pogroms, World War One, the Spanish flu and a firing squad. They came with five children (no contraceptives were available yet), had three more children in NYC in the 1920’s, endured the depression, World War Two and saw the men walk on the moon. When things seemed difficult, I often thought of my grandparents’ strength and endurance to make it all work. We have the capacity for all we desire. It takes dreaming, goal setting, effort, prioritizing, and believing it can be done. Every generation has its progress and setbacks. I agree with the comments here regarding expectations: we can have what we work towards, however, perhaps not at the time we desire. Sometimes we have to compromise or have patience.
The kids may not be all right. If nothing changes, or is allowed to change, housing will be unaffordable to most middle income earners. It already mostly is, and is not getting better.
Someone must be paying for these expensive houses, otherwise the prices would come down. The extremely wealthy for whom price is no object are probably not the culprits, because they want mansions with views, near the golf courses and marinas. That ought to leave plenty of middle class housing in normal average neighborhoods for the rest of us, yet somehow that’s not the case. There is definitely a disconnect somewhere and the cynical side of me says it’s not by accident, but I don’t know enough about it to even attempt to know who to blame.
There are many, many factors, some interrelated and some standalone. Placing blame is not productive, and often derails consensus building. Things we could do locally to encourage more building is to allow for more density, and a diversity of housing types. We have not, generally, built starter homes in the northeast for several decades, as they are not profitable for builders, especially in areas with large minimum lot sizes. There are many studies that discuss this. Here’s a link to one that focuses on the lower Hudson Valley: https://www.pattern-for-progress.org/portfolio/outofreach2024/
I think in our market the secondary housing market - Airbnb for tourists - is an influence as well.
yes,
Oh man, I hope not. The husband has a masters.
We’re certainly facing some challenges in our economy these days, ones we didn’t face fifty years ago.
Markets and manufacturing are now global. New technology has upended how we do business. Agriculture is more and more a corporate enterprise rather than a local one, with family farms disappearing. Many businesses have relocated in an effort to reduce costs (that is, pay their workers less) and maintain or increase profits. In the retail sector, local retail is struggling to compete against the Walmarts and Dollar Store giants. Manufacturing has lost out to the service sector as an engine of our economy. Membership in labor unions is at an all time low.
We seem to have, in some ways, reverted to the Robber Baron era of the late 1800’s, where large private enterprises and their owners amassed great wealth through exploitative practices.
It’s time for our government to better address the needs of lower- and middle-income people, and of the vulnerable, instead of catering to the desires of the powerful and wealthy.
The powerful and wealthy own the politicians. The lower and middle income people are just trying to survive in this economy. Our National Grid bill this month $650.
Oh my!
That used to be a mortgage payment!
Why Interest Rate Cuts Won’t Fix a Global Housing Affordability Crisis https://www.nytimes.com/2024/08/30/business/economy/interest-rate-cuts-housing-affordability-crisis.html?unlocked_article_code=1.IE4.izf7.BdzFLq1-SpQI
I just read this NYT article in reference to the topic you raised, Ken.
VP Harris is talking about tackling two sides of the housing problem. She is proposing helping first time home buyers with a 25K down payment, and regulating rental gouging by companies that are buying large number of dwellings in an area and proceeding to raise rates. As an economist, I see housing supply as the biggest problem for young home buyers. Around our area, we see apartment clusters being built as rental units. Our children are paying rent that used to be almost enough to make a mortgage payment. It is a tough situation that needs intervention. Perhaps some added tax incentives for the private sector to build houses in target areas around the country would help. Urban planning will also have to include better public transportation, schools, and more.
My children feel the exact same way. They have done everything right but don’t see a path to home ownership AND children because of the cost. They can’t compete with cash offers on homes over $250,000 and starter homes are tiny with those big prices.
They have been living in an apartment for 8 years. Tiny. And your accusation that they feel entitled is insulting but I’m not surprised by it.
To Will and Ken - On Another Topic:
Went to the Glens Falls Planning Board meeting yesterday re the Glen Street planned demolition of that gorgeous house at 391. About 80 people were there, clearly to protest the ugly building that might replace it. BUT, the clever and devious owner requested his case be tabled until next month.
Please persist in your information spreading, so that lots of protesters will come in October.
I am certainly not against affordable housing, zoning changes to increase density, reduce required lot sizes, etc., but demolishing one's beautiful heritage shouldn't be the means to that end.
I was there as well and the delay did not surprise me. They may continue to delay until things calm down and folks move on to another issue.
I hope you and Will and everyone who has been made aware of this issue keep it in the public eye for next month's meeting and beyond.
I remember a visit to Glens Falls when my uncle was still President(I think) of the college and he and my aunt lived on or next to a pond that ducks spent the winter on. Still have a picture somewhere of him sitting in a lawn chair (in the snow) with one duck on his head and others all around him. I remember seeing - I think - a wood duck family with a next in one of the trees on the pond. This was many years ago.
I hope there will be another large group next time. I was heartened to see as many people as I did there. This kind of thoughtless project shouldn’t be allowed to happen on Glen Street let alone other streets in our city. I also find it unconscionable that there was no overs it on the finished project behind the old middle school. His plans called for raised planters and grass not Astro turf and a cement wall. Where is the follow through but the city. Shame on him and shame on us for letting this be overlooked.
I’m hoping Will Doolittle keeps this in the forefront so people won’t forget to attend.
Will deserves a lot of credit for bringing this to the public's attention. It's a reminder that journalist takes many forms these days.
And thank goodness for both of you. Without good journalism we wouldn’t know what’s going on in town until it was too late
I say... round all prices to the "nearest" tenth of a dollar.
$.95 becomes $.9 or ninety cents.
$10.99 becomes $10.9.
And get rid of both pennies and nickels.
You can't buy anything for 5¢.
I agree. I think this was the topic of a West Wing episode at one point. They failed too.
In 2016, the NYT guessed that we keep the penny because Abraham Lincoln is on it:
https://www.nytimes.com/2016/10/11/insider/why-doesnt-the-united-states-finally-get-rid-of-the-penny.html?smid=url-share
That's great news about the objections to Patten's plans.
But... he's not changing his mind, amirite? Need the public to come back next month, too!
Probably not.
Patten absolutely is hoping to make us tired...don't let up!
He knows that we're watching .
Good advice.
Big government and big government spending hurts everyone, especially young people starting out.
We deserve universal healthcare and should not be slaves to insurance company middlemen who are parasites between doctors and their patients.
Regarding pennies: I was getting ready to take my change jar to the coin machine at the Price Chopper when this happened https://www.tiktok.com/@thomastheodoregra14/video/7405308205754060074?is_from_webapp=1&sender_device=pc&web_id=7219700306077419054
I'm a senior, but it strikes me that many of our young generation are spoiled due to the relative affluence they we raised in. For example, many more young couples are childless and yet they own pets which cost them thousands a year and drain their resources. They also often fall into money traps such as carrying CD debt. Mommy and Daddy might be unable to help them,but if they start living within their means and budget wisely, they should be able to buy a home and have kids.
Well, if they are spoiled, I guess we parents have to take some of that responsibility. Right?
Absolutely
I'm a senior too - and yeah there are spoiled young people - few older ones too! But another part of the blame goes to our education process. There is a lack of history and civics being taught presently, and frankly, it wouldnt be a bad thing to teach kids common sense in regard to the difference between wanting something and needing it. Possibly learning how to make up a budget & stick to it. Having the newest version of whatever really isnt necessary - but that pertains to not only young people but the parents. It feels like thats where much of the credit card debt comes from.
On the other hand - maybe this is the usual looking at the difference between one generation and another?
Maybe the younger generations aren’t so much spoiled by affluence, as by unrealistic expectations. TV, and now social media, has amped them up even more. We compare ourselves to what we think everyone else has. Look at the apartment in the old Honeymooners show. Jackie Gleason’s character was a bus driver, I think, a nice middle class job, and their apartment was small, simple and not much to look at. Archie Bunker was a blue collar worker, and the house in All in the Family was also modest and plain, but I don’t think either of those sets were supposed to imply desperate poverty. They were probably supposed to seem like appropriate accommodations for the characters, and no one watching was supposed to feel sorry for them for where they lived. I think over the years the depictions of middle class homes in television and film have been upgraded, for lack of a better word, so that it seems normal for characters with middle class jobs to live in large, beautifully decorated homes, with landscaped yards, and brand new cars, or in fashionable lofts in trendy cities. (There’s probably a lot of subliminal product placement behind that!) Everyone is out looking for fabulousness right off the bat, and so that is what builders are offering. And those large fancy homes and luxury apartments cost more to build and to buy.
We all need to be diligent and show back up to the meeting next month!!!!!!!
In regards to the Planning Board Meeting last evening. It was good to see so many people show up for the meeting regarding Chris Patten's ongoing projects. It is an absolute shame that the resident of 391 Glen has been given an eviction notice. Shame on those Attorneys who still own the BLDGs, (Patten does have a contract on the property). Hopefully the additonal month will give us more time to gather MORE people for the next meeting.
Several people complained to the board that we could not hear them. They spoke up for a brief moment but went back to speaking softy which made it difficult to hear their remarks. I found very little concern from the board for all the people in the room to see diagrams of proposed signage, etc. and to speak up so ALL people could hear them and the speakers. Lets try to do a better job so we are all informed of what is being presented, etc.
On top of everything else, young people have to tackle climate change, and the really young ones have to face gun violence in their schools. It’s harder for young people now.
I think life is all about priorities. My husband and I grew up in NY towns we could not afford to buy houses in, so we moved to lower cost areas. We both had good solid jobs as systems engineers in IBM in our 30’s. Interest rates in the mid 1980’s were 18%. Our parents had little savings and could not help us with a down payment, so we bit the bullet, used all our measly savings, paid PMI by paying less than 20% down, and jumped in. To make matters worse, we could no longer depend on mass transit, moving from NYC, and had to buy two train tickets for commuting, and a car to get to the train station, buy groceries, and visit our families. Our furniture was hand me downs, or we did without.
Fast forward: We are now in our middle and late 70’s, retired, put our daughters through college without loans, and I’m proud to say our children are in their 30’s, have three children each and own their own homes. I believe dreams can come true if one sets goals and prioritizes needs and wants. Unless one comes from wealth, it’s not until the mid 30’s where dreams become realities.
Coming out of school, landing a great paying job and having a house in a great neighborhood and a fancy car take time, effort, and prioritizing. My grandmother and grandfather ran from Europe after countless pogroms, World War One, the Spanish flu and a firing squad. They came with five children (no contraceptives were available yet), had three more children in NYC in the 1920’s, endured the depression, World War Two and saw the men walk on the moon. When things seemed difficult, I often thought of my grandparents’ strength and endurance to make it all work. We have the capacity for all we desire. It takes dreaming, goal setting, effort, prioritizing, and believing it can be done. Every generation has its progress and setbacks. I agree with the comments here regarding expectations: we can have what we work towards, however, perhaps not at the time we desire. Sometimes we have to compromise or have patience.