Being banned for life certainly doesn’t mean being forgotten! I am only the most casual of baseball fans, and I know the names of Pete Rose, and Shoeless Joe, and the Black Sox story, but I would be hard pressed to name more than a handful of Hall of Fame members. Being banned kind of enshrined them anyway.
As a way of addressing both Pete Rose’s skill and accomplishments as a player and his ethical transgressions, perhaps the Baseball Hall of Fame could establish a new wing called the Hall of Shame. That way, the full scope of his baseball career can be formally recognized. Rose could be the inaugural inductee into this new wing.
True, there’s enough corruption in baseball to write numerous books. My concern is the increasing trend in our country to excuse objectively proven corrupt behavior, thus normalizing it and treating the perpetrators as though they are somehow victims.
“Charlie Hustle” or “Charlie Hustler”. Good point-counterpoint, and wouldn’t many say both are true? I just finished reading Kevin Baker’s sensational “New York Game” (see Times review online), a history of Major League Baseball that says that gamblers, fixers, alcoholics and assorted other reprobates dominated the game AT LEAST until the Black Sox scandal of 1919.
So, without really knowing the backgrounds of many Hall of Famers, I am guessing Pete Rose would be in some good non-Puritan company if he gets into the Hall. But, from what I have read, Rose does stand out in this way: he allegedly served several months in jail for tax evasion; when he was asked about allegations that he had sex with a juvenile girl (rape), he reportedly responded something like this: “that was a long time ago, babe.” Less of consequence but indicative of his style, within the past few years, it was reported that he made an incredibly sexual (not just sexist) comment to the wife of a well-known Cincinnati sportscaster.I know in this age, almost anything goes, and I know President Trump is pushing his induction, but don’t we have to “cling to our standards” at some point.
As for the Canadian situation...nothing the North Country does is going to change what happens. The only thing that will change it is 1) get rid of tRump. 2) cancel the tariffs... "Mike-drop"!
...banning fluoride!?: "There's something rotten in the state of America(n mouths)!" / the "North country" is deeply "red," [i.e. MAGA]...and it is losing funding, jobs and Canadian business; sadly, for others: voters, up there, who voted for royalty opened the door to these closing doors when they voted for their king who, doubtless [even as they weep and bitterly complain about these losses], they still support...
Apologizing for the government they support is duplicitous. The north country and her representatives resoundingly support the current administration and it isn't just the Canadians who are repulsed and angry. For better or for worse, Americans have branded themselves and unless and until we change course, few foreigners will take the time to discern if any local business is merely a victim of her government or flying a Canadian flag to pretend they don't support the American regime. This is who we are. If we don't like it, we can change it.
I visited the HOF last year and although Rose had no plaque on the wall, many of the exhibits included his name. He certainly ranks high among the baseball greats. And he only bet on his own team!
WellWell, that's what Rose said, but his managing could have influenced how bad he wanted to win that game. Rose is all over the Hall of Fame, especially during the 1970s time line about the Big Red Machine.
Agree with you that Pete Rose's incredible achievements on the field as a player should be recognized but if it's left to veterans to make that decision, it would appear a majority have strong adverse feelings about anything they view as "cheating." You are also correct that the hypocrisy evidenced in Major League Baseball's embracing gambling advertising as a means of somehow adding "interest" in the game is shameful. I find it ridiculous that so many of the radio sports talk shows are simply exploring the betting odds on just about any aspect of the game (and that applies to all sports, especially football). Enjoy listening to Dan Patrick because he really is a sports journalist in the best sense of the term.
I can't imagine why anyone would bet on baseball. No way to handicap it beyond the pitching matchups and starting pitchers don't go very long these days.
"Putting fluoride in drinking water in Florida is now banned."
Also banned in Utah for public water systems.
The supposed rationale for these bans is that residents should have a choice of whether or not they use fluoride, despite its proven value. One problem, though, is the Trump administration is removing the personal choice of parents to use fluoride supplements for their children.
RFKJr, through the FDA, is actively moving to ban the use of fluoride tablets, drops, and lozenges for children. These prescription fluoride supplements are typically recommended for kids who do not have access to fluoridated water to help prevent cavities.
So we have personal choice over our health and health care, except when Trump says we don't.
as for pete rose: i’ve long said that his on-the-field accomplishments qualify him for the hall of fame, but that no decision to include him should be made before he died. he should die without knowing whether he’d ever have a plaque there. my problem with manfred’s decision is that anyone banned for life now will know that the ban will be lifted when they die. manfred should not have gone that far. these decisions ought to be case-by-case, posthumously, and the black sox players should not have been included.
"North Country Public Radio continues to report on the ways in which the Trump administration is cutting funding for organizations all across the North Country."
Jamelle Bouie, in his opinion piece for the NYT, addresses this very issue this way:
"The irony is that for all of the Republican Party’s cultural affinity for rural America, its policy agenda is singularly hostile to the material interests of the millions of Americans who live in rural areas. But no one seems to want to ask Republicans, or Donald Trump for that matter, to explain the yawning distance between what they promise for rural Americans and what they actually do for rural Americans."
Obviously, our Congresswoman Elise Stefanik will not be addressing this dislocation in her own so-called "representation" of the North Country. Like Trump, she’ll just bully her way forward.
...speaking of baseball & politicians, an appropriate title to a biography of Elise Stefanik: Field of Schemes / [her obvious position in the filed of politics: (self)center field]...
Ethics no longer seem to matter much. On or off the field.
Except the people who could benefit most from fluoride down there probably can’t afford a dentist.
Seems like mandatory dental care from the state should be companion legislation.
Agreed
Being banned for life certainly doesn’t mean being forgotten! I am only the most casual of baseball fans, and I know the names of Pete Rose, and Shoeless Joe, and the Black Sox story, but I would be hard pressed to name more than a handful of Hall of Fame members. Being banned kind of enshrined them anyway.
Fluoride helps prevent tooth decay, and it is stupid to ban it!
As for Pete Rose and shoeless Joe Jackson… It’s time let them in the Hall of Fame … they deserve it. We are all human and fallible.
Jackson did take the money and try to throw the World Series, so I still oppose his admission.
As a way of addressing both Pete Rose’s skill and accomplishments as a player and his ethical transgressions, perhaps the Baseball Hall of Fame could establish a new wing called the Hall of Shame. That way, the full scope of his baseball career can be formally recognized. Rose could be the inaugural inductee into this new wing.
There is a book by that name that is pretty entertaining.
True, there’s enough corruption in baseball to write numerous books. My concern is the increasing trend in our country to excuse objectively proven corrupt behavior, thus normalizing it and treating the perpetrators as though they are somehow victims.
Sort of describes our political system and the "victims" in the administration!
“Charlie Hustle” or “Charlie Hustler”. Good point-counterpoint, and wouldn’t many say both are true? I just finished reading Kevin Baker’s sensational “New York Game” (see Times review online), a history of Major League Baseball that says that gamblers, fixers, alcoholics and assorted other reprobates dominated the game AT LEAST until the Black Sox scandal of 1919.
So, without really knowing the backgrounds of many Hall of Famers, I am guessing Pete Rose would be in some good non-Puritan company if he gets into the Hall. But, from what I have read, Rose does stand out in this way: he allegedly served several months in jail for tax evasion; when he was asked about allegations that he had sex with a juvenile girl (rape), he reportedly responded something like this: “that was a long time ago, babe.” Less of consequence but indicative of his style, within the past few years, it was reported that he made an incredibly sexual (not just sexist) comment to the wife of a well-known Cincinnati sportscaster.I know in this age, almost anything goes, and I know President Trump is pushing his induction, but don’t we have to “cling to our standards” at some point.
Obviously baseball had a big drug proemlem even in recent times - see Dwight Gooden and Darryl Strawberry.
Ditto to what David wrote!
As for the Canadian situation...nothing the North Country does is going to change what happens. The only thing that will change it is 1) get rid of tRump. 2) cancel the tariffs... "Mike-drop"!
There are no words...for the Congress dereliction of its duty!!! We need to bombard their offices with our outrage!
...banning fluoride!?: "There's something rotten in the state of America(n mouths)!" / the "North country" is deeply "red," [i.e. MAGA]...and it is losing funding, jobs and Canadian business; sadly, for others: voters, up there, who voted for royalty opened the door to these closing doors when they voted for their king who, doubtless [even as they weep and bitterly complain about these losses], they still support...
Apologizing for the government they support is duplicitous. The north country and her representatives resoundingly support the current administration and it isn't just the Canadians who are repulsed and angry. For better or for worse, Americans have branded themselves and unless and until we change course, few foreigners will take the time to discern if any local business is merely a victim of her government or flying a Canadian flag to pretend they don't support the American regime. This is who we are. If we don't like it, we can change it.
I visited the HOF last year and although Rose had no plaque on the wall, many of the exhibits included his name. He certainly ranks high among the baseball greats. And he only bet on his own team!
WellWell, that's what Rose said, but his managing could have influenced how bad he wanted to win that game. Rose is all over the Hall of Fame, especially during the 1970s time line about the Big Red Machine.
Agree with you that Pete Rose's incredible achievements on the field as a player should be recognized but if it's left to veterans to make that decision, it would appear a majority have strong adverse feelings about anything they view as "cheating." You are also correct that the hypocrisy evidenced in Major League Baseball's embracing gambling advertising as a means of somehow adding "interest" in the game is shameful. I find it ridiculous that so many of the radio sports talk shows are simply exploring the betting odds on just about any aspect of the game (and that applies to all sports, especially football). Enjoy listening to Dan Patrick because he really is a sports journalist in the best sense of the term.
I can't imagine why anyone would bet on baseball. No way to handicap it beyond the pitching matchups and starting pitchers don't go very long these days.
"Putting fluoride in drinking water in Florida is now banned."
Also banned in Utah for public water systems.
The supposed rationale for these bans is that residents should have a choice of whether or not they use fluoride, despite its proven value. One problem, though, is the Trump administration is removing the personal choice of parents to use fluoride supplements for their children.
RFKJr, through the FDA, is actively moving to ban the use of fluoride tablets, drops, and lozenges for children. These prescription fluoride supplements are typically recommended for kids who do not have access to fluoridated water to help prevent cavities.
So we have personal choice over our health and health care, except when Trump says we don't.
as for pete rose: i’ve long said that his on-the-field accomplishments qualify him for the hall of fame, but that no decision to include him should be made before he died. he should die without knowing whether he’d ever have a plaque there. my problem with manfred’s decision is that anyone banned for life now will know that the ban will be lifted when they die. manfred should not have gone that far. these decisions ought to be case-by-case, posthumously, and the black sox players should not have been included.
I would agree with that.
"North Country Public Radio continues to report on the ways in which the Trump administration is cutting funding for organizations all across the North Country."
Jamelle Bouie, in his opinion piece for the NYT, addresses this very issue this way:
"The irony is that for all of the Republican Party’s cultural affinity for rural America, its policy agenda is singularly hostile to the material interests of the millions of Americans who live in rural areas. But no one seems to want to ask Republicans, or Donald Trump for that matter, to explain the yawning distance between what they promise for rural Americans and what they actually do for rural Americans."
Obviously, our Congresswoman Elise Stefanik will not be addressing this dislocation in her own so-called "representation" of the North Country. Like Trump, she’ll just bully her way forward.
But she did say in Ticonderoga that the Trump administration supported celebrating the 250th anniversary of the Declaration of Independence.
Even though he doesn’t know what the Declaration says, he’s for it!
...speaking of baseball & politicians, an appropriate title to a biography of Elise Stefanik: Field of Schemes / [her obvious position in the filed of politics: (self)center field]...
Love it.